Real Media

[Guest]

with all due respect, there is a version of mplayer for OSX available here:


http://sourceforge.net/projects/mplayerosx/


Thanks for the great program

[The DJ]

According to our reading of the GPL license (in use by both mplayer and vlc) mplayerOSX is violating their own licensing.

[Guest]

According to our reading of the GPL license (in use by both mplayer and vlc) mplayerOSX is violating their own licensing.

That is exactly why none of MPlayer versions are in any official Debian repository. I am on debian sid with xfce 4.2 and I am forced to install realplayer 10.2 binaries (from helix community) beside my WxVLC 0.8.1, so yes I am still keeping 2 players.

Expecting VLC team to 'include' real media codecs with their distribution is out of the question here i can understand but giving people the option to write/steal/copy whatever codecs they want and hang it on their vlc setup will not violate any copyright laws because you are not including those codecs. Windoz/Mac-Fuss X users who are asking you to include the actual codecs suffer from their ignorance, linux users only want to see their "choose your w32codecs folder" option somewhere in preferences. That is more or less kind of all of it.

In the mean time we are still refusing to install mplayer and vlc doesn't support real media files so the search for 'how you eliminate real player on linux' continues......

[robUx4]

As one of the Matroska guys I think I should express my point of view on this.

Matroska is used a lot with RealVideo. We didn't plan it and encourage it. It's just that encoders found it best for their use. Unfortunately these files are only playable with DirectShow applications or using hacks in MPlayer. So in the end most people think Matroska is unreadable on their platform. And we are not happy about that.

We tried to get in touch with the Real people to see if they would ship a matroska plugin in their player (available on most platforms). The answer was NO (even if we code it on our own).

So we are on our own. Since I don't know any application on OS X out of their player using RealVideo, I think there is no immediate solution there... So we have to concentrate on Windows and x86 Linux. And I would like some people from VLC or DirectShow coders to see how VLC could access the Real DS filters (used by Gabest's filter). That could even be legal as it would just be a VLC plugin. That might even ship separately from VLC...

[Flo!]

I'm not sur to have understood all the messages...
I'm wondering if it would be a licensing violation to add an option to let people install manually real media source filters (and splitters) ?

What could make it outlaw ?


- sorry if my english is not good -

[flocmoimeme]

Yes, a kind of possibility for the users to add the official filters themselves (thanks to real alternative)...
As firefox with sun microsystems java, macromedia flash, etc. (but mabe the licencing is different ?)

Would this be against the aim of the project ?
Just a way to encourage people to use it, and make the things easier for active users...

Note that the lack of real player filters is the ONLY reason i do not use VLC... I would like to, but the majority of my movies are in mkv/real...
OK, I've got the ogg sound but i would like to see the image too.

[Guest]

I'm not sur to have understood all the messages...
I'm wondering if it would be a licensing violation to add an option to let people install manually real media source filters (and splitters) ?

What could make it outlaw ?


- sorry if my english is not good -

agree

[jake]

Derek,

in the spirit of GPL, I totally agree a workaround allowing the end-user choice to install codecs - aren't you guys at VLC interested in providing the best open player on the market?

[Guest]

any news on it?

[fkuehne]

any news on it?

No. VLC does not and will not support current RealMedia-codecs until free implementations exist.

[Tholek]

I think we all understand the official stance on this subject, so I guess the ball falls into the modder/hacker's court.

It would be interesting to know how one, on their own, taking the full responsibility. without any knowledge, approval, endorsement and whatnot on the part of Videolan, were to mod their player, or real codecs to view real video in VLC.

It would be nice to know....

[Guest]

instead of bugging the vlc people, why not complain to the real media people to release their codecs under gpl license like the other codecs?

[Guest]

Since VLC cant play Real Media files im going to have to stop using it, im converting all of my video files into .rm because of the significant reduction in file size. I would hope that sooner or later we would be able to use VLC to play Real Media seing as in my opinion VLC is the best player I have ever used.

[dionoea]

You should use H264 instead. Its supported by many apps (VLC, mplayer, quicktime) and is the best video codec available AFAIK.

[tyu]

Would VideoLAN qualify for an "R&D" license? If so, perhaps the VLC project could apply for an R&D license. According to the Helix site, the license is free, but don't know if there are any other costs associated with obtaining the SDK.

https://helixcommunity.org/content/licenses

Research & Development Licenses

R & D licenses for RealAudio and RealVideo are no-cost and allow you to have access to the source code for the codecs:

• Real Format Source Code Porting And Optimization License - Client: This allows for R&D use of source code for the specific purpose of porting and optimizing the RealAudio and RealVideo decoders, as well as the ".rm" File Format and the RDT transport code.
  
  Real Format Source Code Porting And Optimization License - Encoder (This license is not posted yet. Send inquiries to open-licensing@helixcommunity.org): This license allows for research and development use of source code for the specific purpose of porting and optimizing several add-on components, including RealAudio and RealVideo encoders, the ".rm" file writer writer component, and broadcast DLL.

These Helix licenses need to be signed and returned for approval. Please review the summary of licensing terms and how to submit a license. Once your license submission is approved, you will be sent instructions on how to access the source code site for RealAudio and RealVideo and Real Format SDK (note: these pages are restricted and only accessible to licensees).

[Hector]

As I see this, the focus here should not be whether or not the VLC developers should be developing a realmedia plugin, but whether someone can be bothered to build a bridge between VLC and the realmedia codec, to then have this bridge be a plugin itself. I'm sure this bridge could be built in a platform independent way so that, say, it will expect the rm codecs to be installed to a certain directory or something. Then, the vlc guys don't need to worry about licensing - and someone else distributes (perhaps realalternative or someone like that) the bridge between the rm codecs and vlc. MPlayer does something like this, in a much less clean way. This solution seems to be to be fairly straightforward. Thoughts?

[Guest]

What is the problem with real media? Realmedia uses 4 different video codecs and 10 different audio codecs. The video codecs are:

RV10: H.263 - There are open source decoders for this.
RV20: RealVideo G2 - ffmpeg libavcodec supports this.
RV30: RealVideo 8 - Proprietary, no open source decoder.
RV40: RealVideo 9 - Proprietary, no open source decoder.

Audio codecs:

14_4: IS-54 VSELP - ffmpeg libavcodec has a decoder for this.
28_8: G.728 - Several open source decoders for this.
dnet: A52/AC3 - VLC already supports this codec.
sipr: Sipro ACELP.NET - Proprietary, no open source decoder.
cook: RealAudio G2/Gecko - Proprietary, no open source decoder.
atrc: ATRAC3 - No open source decoder that I know of.
raac: LC-AAC - VLC already supports this codec.
racp: HE-AAC - VLC already supports this codec.
ralf: RealAudio Lossless - Proprietary, no open source decoder.
whrl: Variant of 'cook' - Proprietary, no open source decoder.

So it seems like there are GPL-compatible decoders for 2/4 RealVideo codecs, and 5/10 audio codecs. So VLC ought to be able to play at least some RealMedia files using the existing codecs.

[Guest]

there is also RV13 which can be decoded by FFmpeg RV10 decoder, with
* Linux binary codecs loader
in theory we could use real/helix .dll files to decode everything, maybe not in basic install because possible license problems (API can't be any harder than WMV API right?).
But container format could be much more of problem, no SMIL support at the moment?

[Birki69]

my suggestion is, that it would be great if you put a button or smth. in the Settings Dialog,that says "connect to OS library". The function is that it determines what OS it is running on, an than it uses these librarys. I know that this would mean that you have to rewrite this function for every OS you implement, but that wouldnt be the first time. That way you would give every user the choice wheather or not he wants to use the OSes codecs or the ones of VLC


If you could do smth like this, i could finally dump my MPC.

[VLC had never let me down]

Im a constant user of video lan and use it as my default media player i have also recommended videolan to every1 else because of how reliable it is and how it supports every video format there is. But just recently i encountered a media file called rmvb. this little bugger has put vlc to shame. This is not a dissatisfactionary comment as i still believe that VLC is the best and the only one media player movie goers shud have, but a challenge for the bakers of VLC to correct or update this hiccup so we can all enjoy the flavoursom fruits of internet media with all confidence!!

[Guest]

so no one is developing a plug in for it?

[seden]

mpc stand for a MPEG2 video formated codec (MPC is also named Mpeg Plus and MP+).

Currently i have only found Winamp who is able to open this format (using a certain plugin btw) so should this format be readed by VLC ?

You are doing a trully good job with that project, keep up the motivation !
Le MPC est basé sur le format vidéo MPEG 2, c'est pour cela qu'il est également appelé Mpeg Plus ou MP+. C'est un format destructeur qui permet de créer des fichiers audio d'excellente qualité (qualité bien supérieure au MP3 ou Ogg Vorbis).

[Drunkguitarist]

[Obviously illegal links removed by moderator. Please share this kind of information on places which aren't run by known people who want to continue a normal life without passive law infringements -- FK]

[Guest]

What's the point of making an all-in-one media player if it doesn't play everything? Just abandon your neckbeard license and make something decent, because your player sucks compared to mplayer and Media Player Classic.

See, the developers could make the plugin themselves and simply open source it without a GPL license, but they're just masquerading their LOL I H8 BILL GATE$$ agenda behind their GPL excuses.

[Hiromitz]

so no one is developing a plug in for it?

i think no one understands. Vlc doesnt want to do, cant do, will not do... because they get their arse sued to high hell... plus its for mac OS and Windows ,.... which btw HELLO linx is not in that group so they have to work around what they have on linix and make it hopefully work <b>WHICH THEY CANT'!</b> People get over it i only use my vlc playier for conventional means of watchin dvd's and anime...

so to simplify this situation for "the lesser intellegence"

1.<b> Shut up </b>
2. Complain to real Media about their Copywrites and have them change it...
3. <b> Wait....for a reply or news that realmedia playiers copywrite crud gets changed and wala then you can do somin... </b>

4. Use other methods of compression OR HEY beter yet put real playier out of buisness buy not using their format! XP their you go pat your self on the back worthy of self gratification as i waisted 15mins reading this lousy sited complaints by "beggers" who talk and dont shut up....

<b>(thank you for your time i'm sure you didnt read it) </b>