Positioning subtitles below the movie

[Dingen]

In my VLC 0.8.2 under "Preferences" -> "Video" -> "Subtitles / OSD" with the "advanced"-box checked on, there is an option called "force subtitle position". When hovering the mousecursor over this option, an explanation pops up, saying you can use this fuction if you want the subtitles to be displayed under the movie, instead of over it. This is exactly what I want, but whatever value (positive or negative) I enter in the "force subtitle position"-field, nothing seems to happen, not even after restarting the VLC application.

How do I get this option to work?

[Guest]

In my VLC 0.8.2 under "Preferences" -> "Video" -> "Subtitles / OSD" with the "advanced"-box checked on, there is an option called "force subtitle position". When hovering the mousecursor over this option, an explanation pops up, saying you can use this fuction if you want the subtitles to be displayed under the movie, instead of over it. This is exactly what I want, but whatever value (positive or negative) I enter in the "force subtitle position"-field, nothing seems to happen, not even after restarting the VLC application.

How do I get this option to work?

Exactly the same problem with 0.8.2 here! Anyone?

[fkuehne]

This does only work with text-subtitles. DVD-subs or bitmapped subs (such as VobSub) don't work.
Additionally, this feature is completely broken in later versions than 0.8.2, but it does still run in that release.

[Dingen]

This does only work with text-subtitles. DVD-subs or bitmapped subs (such as VobSub) don't work.
Additionally, this feature is completely broken in later versions than 0.8.2, but it does still run in that release.

That really is too bad. I hope this features gets fixed in later releases of VLC and will be compatible with all types of subtitles.

[Santos]

But what if the subfile is a simple .txt file and it still doesnt work?

[poop]

i dont think we will ever get an answer

[fkuehne]

Well, I can't answer here, because I've never heard of subtitles written to a simple .txt-file. Such a file needs to be a bit more complex (including a timestamp for the specific sub, etc. pp.) to be played as far as I know.

BTW. As you can see in my previous response:

Additionally, this feature is completely broken in later versions than 0.8.2, but it does still run in that release.

That's meant for plain text subtitles, so they can't be moved indeed. VLC 0.8.2 is the last current version with that feature, but I hope that this will return in 0.8.5.

[D@vid]

VLC 0.8.2 is the last current version with that feature

I've just tried to position the text in both version 0.8.2 and 0.8.4 with no result in either of them. (I used .srt subtitles)
Also I hope it'll be fixed in next version.

[Guest]

Same question..i have .srt subtitle file...i want to use it with divx movie but the force postion doesn't work and also the subtitles are not brighter as shown in BSPlayer...How to change the position of the sub below the movie..it's very anooying to have them displayed on the movie.....Any Help Plz i have downlaoded the 0.8.4a but still no luck..... ....Also i posted some time ago that menus are Transparent in windows xp(using p3)..but still it is not solved>>>???

[haldejung]

Is there a chance Bitmap subs (VobSub) we'll be movable ever?
I tried to add extra black space at the buttom of the movie (no cropping it from 16:9) but vlc (0.8.5) still renders all subs into the image itself and not below.

[DJ]

This is a very old question and has been answered lots of times. You can't put subs where there is no video. Many times the video is letter boxed so the black borders are there but not really part of the video. But VOBSub in particular is images overlayed. How would you move that? While in other (text based formats) it may be possible.

[vlcfiend]

This feature has been broken for a couple of years now.

A simple suggestion then:

Either fix this promptly, at least for plaintext subtitle files like the .srt format.

Or else promptly remove it from the settings menu completely.

I really want such a feature and hope that you'll fix it. Other players can do it so I hope VLC will too. Compared to all the other "magic" VLC can accomplish, this seems to my non-programmer eyes as a small thing to fix.
But if not then please stop giving false hope by leaving it in the settings menu.

[DJ]

This feature has been broken for a couple of years now.

A simple suggestion then:

Either fix this promptly, at least for plaintext subtitle files like the .srt format.

Or else promptly remove it from the settings menu completely.

I really want such a feature and hope that you'll fix it. Other players can do it so I hope VLC will too. Compared to all the other "magic" VLC can accomplish, this seems to my non-programmer eyes as a small thing to fix.
But if not then please stop giving false hope by leaving it in the settings menu.

Actually some of the Devs would like to see it too and that's why it has never been removed and probably won't be removed.

On the other hand if text based subs were to be placed where the video isn't or in the black borders top or bottom that aren't really there, allowances must be made to the player to resize properly.

Personally I haven't seen one that does it correctly yet. MPC like others seem to get part of the sub on the video and part on the border and sometimes it does work but doesn't remain consistent through the video. Also this player does NOT allow the user to move or adjust the sub.

I just find the feature annoying in that if I choose to crop the video I expect the sub to be a part of the video and not in a letterbox that isn't really there. I cropped the video because I didn't want the borders. I don't want a player to artificially create them for me. If I choose to not crop the borders then I expect the subs to be below the video in the borders that are there. Interestingly enough that's the way it works now.

Also if the display were 16x9 (16x10) where are the subs supposed to be? Off screen? Or do we create yet another feature that automatically compensates for this or at very least answer lots of question on this web site as to how to make the subs visible again? This seems like nonsense.

[vlcfiend]

DJ,
if the feature is fixed, then we who want it will activate it. If the default subtitle display is needed in some case (16x9), it's very easy to for the user to temporarily go back to default mode. So there is really no problem.

"Actually some of the Devs would like to see it to"
---
Great! I'm not abandoning hope just yet then!

[DJ]

Yes! I know this and that's kinda why I wrote like I did. But please understand that at the moment this is a low priority and the difficulties (rewrites necessary) to do it.

[Polak]

I've never heard of subtitles written to a simple .txt-file.

... Santos wrote about something like that:
piece of *.txt file:

Code: Select all

{1}{75}movie info: ******* {80}{168}>>>Tłumaczenie - krisstofer<<< {400}{484}>>>Greetz for MwTeam<<<

this is per frame synchro but per second can be to

You can't put subs where there is no video.

hahaha You are just very very lazy i think...

when I've TV in 4:3 and movie in 16:9 I want subtitles on the bottom black border

just download and check how subtitles (*.txt in format shown above) works in these two polish movie players
Cinema Player 1.6 beta 5 or SubEdit Player
in both these players when subtitles shown up I can drag'n'drop vertically where I want to (top or botton black border)

P.S. international program like VLC should have very well working subtitle engine !!! I think this is one of the most important things right now to do...

there are many people on the earth and some of them don't speak english... and americans' "B" class movies are very very popular

(sorry for any gramatical errors I'm still learning english )

[DJ]

I do appreciate what you are trying to say and in general I agree with you.

But when where there is no video, Subtitles can NOT be placed (at least not reliably). When you show a DVD in 16x9 on your 4x3 TV the black borders are a part of the video. The borders were encoded to be part of the video to form compatibility for 16x9 content to show properly on your 4x3 TV. There is no problem in displaying subs on the black borders of this 4x3 video because the borders are a part of the video. When you crop the video (remove the borders) there is no place to put the sub because the sub must be within the video. Therefore it is moved into the picture because the black borders have been removed. But in many cases (by cropping the borders) you are also removing the compatibility for displaying the video on your 4x3 TV.

I have both Subedit and MPC and do see some attempts in this area but it is still not reliable and the player must be resized to accommodate the sub. While this may not be such a difficult task for Text based subtitles, it could be a huge issue for graphics based subs (Subedit doesn't support Graphics based subs) or sub formats like Sub Station Alpha that allow for the creator of the sub to move it anywhere on screen. Moving the sub in and out of the video would be a real feat of programing and is likely to create problems in timing for many formats. VLC can not afford to make mistakes in this area as it is a packet based player that was designed to stream media files and timing is a critical consideration when doing this.

As always the source code is available to anyone who thinks they could make improvements and patches, changes and or additions are always welcomed here.

[Polak]

ok I see Your point of view now

I have never used graphics subtitles... and I'm always watching movies with black borders (monitor/TV in 4:3 and movie in 16:9) and it is difficult to understand for me why sub must be within the video. I thought text-based subtitles are totally non-related to encoded or non-encoded borders and displayed on screen in an overlay mode independently from the movie data.

My english is quite good now I think so I use subtitles more rarely than sometimes.

PS I think CinemaPlayer is better than SubEdit SubEdit is an overlay for WMP and CinemaPlayer has own engine

[jech]

Polak
I've been discussing this feature here already many times. I see everywhere people saying "VLC is a great player, but I can't use it because of poor subtitles support". I would like to help you at least with some ideas, if you want to. Unfortunately I'm not a C/C++ programmer, so I cannot help you with programming.

I know a little bit, how DirectShow works. I think it must work quite similar inside VLC. You have a video stream decoder a then you pass the video to some filters (cropping, subtitles etc. So my idea is to insert a letterbox filter which would add black borders to any video to make it 4:3, 16:10, 16:9 or whatever user prefers. This would add the black borders as a part of a picture. Now it shouldn't be a problem to place subtitles anywhere on the video. Could it work like this? I think the letterbox feature in ffdshow is exactly how I'd like it implemented.

I also understand the problem with graphics subtitles. In fact it is a big problem for computer DVD players, but it works perfect on most standalone players. I wonder why, because usually computer players are much better.

I started a thread at Doom9 forums regarding letterboxing of DVDs. So far only few players can do that. It would be great if VLC could do it.

Btw. I think there are very few movies encoded as letterboxed. The only exception are 2.35:1 DVD movies. But they are still anamorphic 16:9 (720x576 or 720x480).

[DJ]

The issue of letter-boxing is going to become more common as we move into the progressive standards. These are 1.78:1 for standard 16x9 and 2.37:1 for enhanced 16x9. The packed pixel or DAR (what I understand Anamorphic to be) is doubtful to change with this. The idea for a player to create a letterbox for the cropped video is a good one, allowing backward compatibility to 4x3 TVs with some kind of auto scaling. Once all of this was in place, the issue of moving subtitles may become easier assuming users will accept black borders. However 16x10 monitors are becoming more common and there really isn't enough room to present subs in the remaining area. Besides most users want to fill the screen at the expense of correct aspect ratio and this could make this issue a moot topic.

[dizz]

I understand this subtitle positioning feature has been subject of discussion many times already. I am one of those people who would like to use VLC, but who likes to have more control over the subtitles. A couple of things in this thread attracted my attention.

- First the discussion about the black border. In my experience anyone who watches 16x9 or 1.86:1 movies IN FULL SCREEN MODE on a 3x4 monitor or TV has black borders. I do not know a player that does not create black borders in full screen when the aspect ratio of the display does not match the aspect ratio of the movie. Personally I like the subtitles to be displayed in this black space.

- Secondly there is some discussion about the player automatically adjusting the subtitle position. This should not be an issue. The default placement for subs can or should be in the video area, but the user should be allowed to change it. This could be done with a shortcut key or in the preferences. There is no issue for people with 16x9 screens, they just use the default position.

I have used BSplayer for a long time, but unfortunately it has ads in it in the latest releases. However the reason for using that player was its perfect support for subs. What I always did was this:
I have a 4x3 TV and most movies are in 1.86:1. So I zoom in somewhat (1). Next I move the movie area to the top of the screen (2) and finally I place the subs in the black area below the movie (3). The result is that there is no black area above the video and the black area below it is exactly the right size for the subs.
(Step (3) is in fact not really necessary because the user can set in the preference that BSplayer automatically places the subs below the movie.)

It is this behavior that I would like to see in VLC player. Please give it a try in BSplayer, it really does work excellent. (BTW I only tried it with srt subs). I really hope that the sub positioning feature will be updated and that I will be able to use VLC player in the same manner as described above.

[binome]

I think it's too bad VLC doesn't implement this functionality.

Other players (Bsplayer, gomplayer, etc...) have it.
Why is it not possible in VLC ? Is it too difficult to do ? (I'm talking of text subtitles, not graphics ones) I'm sure I'm wrong ! VLC developpers have already shown they're really capable. So what is it ?

Many of my friends would get rid of their player to have VLC if it could print the subtitles on the black zone under the picture when playing a 16/9 movie on a 4/3 scren.

I'm looking for a clear explanation so we can understand.

[WeeDie]

I downloaded VLC because I couldn't get the feature working in Vobsub with media player classic.
It turns out though that almost none of the options for subtitles work in VLC. Why have options that doesn't do anything?

[DJ]

- First the discussion about the black border. In my experience anyone who watches 16x9 or 1.86:1 movies IN FULL SCREEN MODE on a 3x4 monitor or TV has black borders. I do not know a player that does not create black borders in full screen when the aspect ratio of the display does not match the aspect ratio of the movie. Personally I like the subtitles to be displayed in this black space.

The player does NOT create the black borders! A cropped video has no black borders they have been removed.

- Secondly there is some discussion about the player automatically adjusting the subtitle position. This should not be an issue. The default placement for subs can or should be in the video area, but the user should be allowed to change it. This could be done with a shortcut key or in the preferences. There is no issue for people with 16x9 screens, they just use the default position.

You can't place subs in a video area that's not there or at least not reliably. Which of the 9 some odd formats would you like to try?

Contributions in the way of patches and or changes are always welcomed. The source code is available just dig in.
[/quote]

[DJ]

I downloaded VLC because I couldn't get the feature working in Vobsub with media player classic.
It turns out though that almost none of the options for subtitles work in VLC. Why have options that doesn't do anything?

You are correct! Vobsub is a graphic based format and it has its own controls that over ride VLC's. In text based subs the controls work, except for Sub Station Alpha which also has it's own controls.