VCD Movies or DAT files in VLC 0.8.4

[DJ]

I have a some what large collection of VCD's ranging from the original Phillips VCD1 standard to VCD2. Also find it rather easy to convert DVDs
to VCD format that will play on any stand alone DVD player for family viewing.

I'm rather new to VLC, having found it in 6/05 Version 0.8.2 -- I fell in love with it because of all the formats it supported and have used it for the quality reference to update Windows media (activex). In some cases VLC still performs better My main machine is a 2.6 P4 HP Pavilion, ATI graphics & a 100 gig IBM/Hitachi hard drive running windows XP SP2

A few days ago I downloaded VLC-0.8.4 and installed it after removing the old version with add/remove programs and then striping all the references to it (reg edit & directories) After installing 0.8.4 I noticed that I could play and add to a play list everything even my trash bin. A search and destroy with reg edit took care of this weird bug.

I was very pleased to see that some of the old problems with Matroska files have been resolved and that some new features have been added. Certainly haven't tried them all yet, but was looking forward to it when I discovered that VCDs were skipping frames in video and audio also popping. I tried looking at the settings within VLC and tried several VCDs with no results or changes from the original problem. Sense then I have removed VLC 0.8.4 and gone back to 0.8.2 and everything is normal again and VCDs play fine.

Really would like to move forward to the new version, in general it looks good. With VLC 0.8.2 the only file I have run across that wouldn't play correctly is "Star Wars 3 Revenge of The Sith x264-AAC.mkv" Seems the sound plays but video gives a white screen. Of coarse I have run across many bad files but this is not VLC's fault as no other player that I know of will play corrupted files.

If at any point the VCD issue can be addressed I would be happy to move to a newer version or if anyone here has some ideas, please bring it on

[DJ]

Given I have not gotten any help here I have tried to pinpoint the problem and guarantee anyone can repeat it!

I was in error when I said that .DAT files were effected, they are not.

Seems that you avoid the module "libvcd_plugin.dll" when playing a .DAT file directly. However you have no chapter menu, that was implemented on VCD2 disks. To prove this I renamed "libvcd_plugin.dll" and and found I could play .DAT files but VCD calls through VLC failed.

If you call the VCD through VLC's Open -- Open Disk -- VCD feature any VCD 1 or 2 disk will not play properly. However, if you call the .DAT file directly, the file plays normally, but without features.

An ongoing annoyance of VLC seems to be within Windows and the way VLC recognizes replaceable parameters. If you call a audio CD or VCD through the pop up options menu in Windows. Windows puts a "\" in back of the drive letter. Making the full command "D:\" but VLC wants just the drive information "D:" so it fails to play an Audio CD and Plays VCDs .DAT file instead of through the VCD interface. Oddly, DVDs are recognized properly and don't seem to care if the "\" is there or not.

Hope this is helpful to someone and will get fixed eventually!

[DJ]

Seems I keep forgetting things!

One of the more endearing qualities of VLC has been the ability to play image files. As I burn many VCDs it has been real convenient to delete the original files and keep the disk images. While I thought this worked for other types of media disks such as audio CDs etc. It does NOT!

VCDs in image format are called correctly in VLC-0.8.2 and if the disk is a VCD2 with features, the features are available. However, in VLC-0.8.4 all VCDs skip video frames and the audio pops.

It would be nice to have some kind of consistent interface for VLC as it seems that we must remember how we call each and every type of file internally or externally when using VLC as it just may not work or work correctly. The simple example is audio CDs, If called externally it fails. If called internally it works.

[DJ]

Given it has been a few weeks and version 0.8.4a has been released, I can only assume no one cares about VLCs ability to play or stream VCDs as there has been NO response to my original query (or request) for help.

Perhaps concentrating on features and new filter libraries has made these people forget about meeting the standards (base line) for the older libraries in new versions. If you can't get these right (maintain the old standards) in new versions of VLC how can you move forward and establish new standards for experimental libraries (codecs or filters) or for that matter add new features to libraries that no longer function correctly??

Or am I missing something here? Seems there are quit a number of people saying the same thing, when I read content on this forum, just in different words.

[DJ]

I'm just moving this up the list in the hope someone will see it and respond to it.

Or this is a conspiracy to get me to keep me coming back here and answer other peoples questions about VLC

[DJ]

I am now using VLC nightly builds (Jan 2, 06 build). Lots of fixes and does work better for me in general. However, there has still been NO movement to resolving the VCD problems introduced in 0.8.4

I can't even get an acknowledgment to my posts here. Kinda like talking to myself. Form the recent posts that I have been answering, I know I am not the only one with this problem. I suspect that actually everyone has this bug and just hasn't run across it yet!

[dionoea]

I am now using VLC nightly builds (Jan 2, 06 build). Lots of fixes and does work better for me in general. However, there has still been NO movement to resolving the VCD problems introduced in 0.8.4

We have been having problems with VCD support recently. Unfortunately the VCD plugin maintener hasn't been arround for some time. Feel free to dig in the code if you have time

[DJ]

Thank You for the response! This explains allot.

[Guest]

Seems I keep forgetting things!

One of the more endearing qualities of VLC has been the ability to play image files. As I burn many VCDs it has been real convenient to delete the original files and keep the disk images. While I thought this worked for other types of media disks such as audio CDs etc. It does NOT!

VCDs in image format are called correctly in VLC-0.8.2 and if the disk is a VCD2 with features, the features are available. However, in VLC-0.8.4 all VCDs skip video frames and the audio pops.

It would be nice to have some kind of consistent interface for VLC as it seems that we must remember how we call each and every type of file internally or externally when using VLC as it just may not work or work correctly. The simple example is audio CDs, If called externally it fails. If called internally it works.

Yes, I've found playing images before burning very helpful too. (That's why I put it in. )

There are two CD-DA and VCD plugins for vlc that can get built. One set uses the external libcdio library and the other set doesn't. libcdio supports CD image reading: CDRWin's BIN/CUE, cdrdao's TOC and some Nero. So the plugins that use libcdio (VCD or CD-DA) should be able to read CD images and I think I've read CD-DA images in the past.

So the most likely situation is that you are not using the libcdio CD-DA plugin (which also supports CD-Text and CDDB access via libcddb).

Alas, I've always found development on VLC a bit weird. If a person has contributed or worked on plugin X, it's sort of his/her responsibility to monitor what others may do to it, which means following all of VLC development, including all changelogs - quite an undertaking. Probably the libcdio CD-DA plugin was disabled for some reason: certainly without all that much discussion. Perhaps on Windows only, dunno.

[DJ]

The following are the messages obtained while playing the first 10 seconds of the same movie. In the VCD and DAT mode the disk and file was called from within VLC. The image (bin) was called external to VLC (through the Windows interface). While I have files that play slightlly better or worse, this disk is about middle of the road for performance. None of the VCDs I have had any problems in VLC 0.8.2 or in any other player that supports VCDs properly. The problems started with VLC 0.8.4 and continue through the most recent nightly build (1/21/06).

In the case of the .DAT file, there are no reported messages for 15 to 20 min at a time and no precieved problems in watching the movie. In the other two methods of playing the movie the messages continue on and the movie is unwatchable.

1. Calling the disk in VLC to play a VCD:

main debug: adding playlist item `vcd://F:' ( vcd://F: )
main debug: creating new input thread
main debug: waiting for thread completion
main debug: thread 4452 (input) created at priority 1 (src/input/input.c:252)
main debug: `vcd://F:' gives access `vcd' demux `' path `F:'
main debug: creating demux: access='vcd' demux='' path='F:'
main debug: looking for access_demux module: 0 candidates
main warning: no access_demux module matched "vcd"
main debug: creating access 'vcd' path='F:'
main debug: looking for access2 module: 5 candidates
vcd debug: using winNT/2K/XP ioctl layer
vcd debug: p_sectors: 0, 0
vcd debug: p_sectors: 1, 450
vcd debug: p_sectors: 2, 348485
vcd debug: Entry[0] title=0 sector=450

skins2 warning: Cannot find node with id 4
vcd debug: Entry[1] title=0 sector=14813

vcd debug: Entry[2] title=0 sector=32039

vcd debug: Entry[3] title=0 sector=45581

vcd debug: Entry[4] title=0 sector=60038

vcd debug: Entry[5] title=0 sector=76405

vcd debug: Entry[6] title=0 sector=93401

vcd debug: Entry[7] title=0 sector=111059

vcd debug: Entry[8] title=0 sector=125930

vcd debug: Entry[9] title=0 sector=140430

vcd debug: Entry[10] title=0 sector=155473

vcd debug: Entry[11] title=0 sector=171574

vcd debug: Entry[12] title=0 sector=185662

vcd debug: Entry[13] title=0 sector=201309

vcd debug: Entry[14] title=0 sector=216951

vcd debug: Entry[15] title=0 sector=231621

vcd debug: Entry[16] title=0 sector=246725

vcd debug: Entry[17] title=0 sector=265568

vcd debug: Entry[18] title=0 sector=278856

vcd debug: Entry[19] title=0 sector=291847

vcd debug: Entry[20] title=0 sector=306211

vcd debug: Entry[21] title=0 sector=322406

vcd debug: Entry[22] title=0 sector=335891

main debug: using access2 module "vcd"
main debug: pre buffering
main debug: received first data for our buffer
main debug: prebuffering done 46480 bytes in 0s - 4866 kbytes/s
main debug: creating demux: access='vcd' demux='ps' path='F:'
main debug: looking for demux2 module: 2 candidates
ps warning: this does not look like an MPEG PS stream, continuing anyway
main debug: using demux2 module "ps"
vcd warning: unimplemented query in control
main debug: `vcd://F:' successfully opened
ps warning: garbage at input, trying to resync...
ps warning: found sync code
main debug: selecting program id=0
main debug: looking for decoder module: 26 candidates
main debug: using decoder module "libmpeg2"
main debug: thread 3716 (decoder) created at priority 0 (src/input/decoder.c:159)
main debug: looking for decoder module: 26 candidates
main debug: using decoder module "mpeg_audio"
main debug: thread 3772 (decoder) created at priority 2 (src/input/decoder.c:159)
libmpeg2 debug: 352x288 (display 352,288), aspect 563200, sar 16:15, 25.000 fps
main debug: no usable vout present, spawning one
main debug: Registering subpicture channel, ID: 2
main debug: Registering subpicture channel, ID: 3
main debug: Registering subpicture channel, ID: 4
main debug: Registering subpicture channel, ID: 5
mpeg_audio debug: MPGA channels:2 samplerate:48000 bitrate:112
main debug: looking for audio output module: 3 candidates
aout_directx debug: OpenAudio
aout_directx debug: found device: Primary Sound Driver
aout_directx debug: found device: Conexant AMC Audio
aout_directx debug: found device: Modem #0 Line Playback (emulated)
aout_directx debug: device supports 2 channels
aout_directx debug: device supports 1 channel
aout_directx debug: creating DirectSoundThread
main debug: thread 4328 (DirectSound Notification Thread) created at priority 15 (directx.c:374)
aout_directx debug: DirectSoundThread ready
main debug: using audio output module "aout_directx"
main debug: output 's16l' 48000 Hz Stereo frame=1 samples/4 bytes
main debug: mixer 'fl32' 48000 Hz Stereo frame=1 samples/8 bytes
main debug: filter(s) 'fl32'->'s16l' 48000 Hz->48000 Hz Stereo->Stereo
main debug: looking for audio filter module: 24 candidates
main debug: using audio filter module "float32tos16"
main debug: found a filter for the whole conversion
main debug: looking for audio mixer module: 3 candidates
main debug: using audio mixer module "trivial_mixer"
main debug: input 'mpga' 48000 Hz Stereo frame=1152 samples/1161 bytes
main debug: filter(s) 'mpga'->'fl32' 48000 Hz->48000 Hz Stereo->Stereo
main debug: looking for audio filter module: 24 candidates
main debug: using audio filter module "mpgatofixed32"
main debug: found a filter for the whole conversion
main debug: filter(s) 'fl32'->'fl32' 52800 Hz->48000 Hz Stereo->Stereo
main debug: looking for audio filter module: 24 candidates
main debug: using audio filter module "bandlimited_resampler"
main debug: found a filter for the whole conversion
main debug: window size: 781x331
main debug: looking for video output module: 5 candidates
vout_directx debug: creating DirectXEventThread
main debug: waiting for thread completion
vout_directx debug: DirectXCreateWindow
vout_directx debug: Created video sub-window
main debug: thread 4420 (DirectX Events Thread) created at priority 0 (directx.c:263)
vout_directx debug: DirectXEventThread running
vout_directx debug: DirectXInitDDraw
vout_directx debug: directx-device:
vout_directx debug: DirectXEnumCallback: Primary Display Driver, display
vout_directx debug: DirectXEnumCallback: RADEON IGP 345M, \\.\DISPLAY1
vout_directx debug: selecting RADEON IGP 345M, \\.\DISPLAY1
vout_directx debug: screen dimensions (0x0,1024x768)
vout_directx debug: DirectDraw Capabilities: overlay=1 yuvoverlay=1 can_deinterlace_overlay=1 colorkey=1 stretch=1 bltfourcc=1
vout_directx debug: End DirectXInitDDraw
vout_directx debug: DirectXCreateDisplay
vout_directx debug: DirectXCreateClipper
skins2 debug: control query not supported
vout_directx debug: disabling screen saver
main debug: using video output module "vout_directx"
vout_directx debug: NewPictureVec overlay:yes chroma:YV12
vout_directx debug: YUV overlay created successfully
vout_directx debug: End NewPictureVec (succeeded)
main debug: got 1 direct buffer(s)
main debug: picture in 352x288 (0,0,352x288), chroma I420, ar 176:135, sar 16:15
main debug: picture user 352x288 (0,0,352x288), chroma I420, ar 176:135, sar 16:15
main debug: picture out 352x288 (0,0,352x288), chroma I420, ar 176:135, sar 16:15
main debug: direct render, mapping render pictures 0-6 to system pictures 1-7
main debug: waiting for thread completion
main debug: thread 3932 (video output) created at priority 1 (src/video_output/video_output.c:420)
main warning: dts != current_pts (87814)
main warning: vout synchro warning: pts != current_date (-40000)
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (90238)
main warning: buffer is 90238 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: PTS is out of range (1425), dropping buffer
main warning: PTS is out of range (37516), dropping buffer
main warning: PTS is out of range (13605), dropping buffer
main warning: PTS is out of range (-10365), dropping buffer
main warning: PTS is out of range (-34326), dropping buffer
main warning: late picture skipped (37601)
main warning: late picture skipped (118453)
main warning: late picture skipped (78837)
main warning: late picture skipped (39161)
main warning: output PTS is out of range (29469), clearing out
main warning: input PTS is out of range (29556), trashing
main warning: input PTS is out of range (5720), trashing
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (46723)
main warning: late picture skipped (17310)
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (49998)
main warning: PTS is out of range (1828), dropping buffer
main warning: PTS is out of range (-21420), dropping buffer
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (50026)
main warning: buffer is 65005 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: PTS is out of range (-39751), dropping buffer
main warning: buffer is 40818 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (50029)
main warning: timing screwed, stopping resampling
main warning: buffer is 90305 late, triggering upsampling
main debug: decoded 117/120 pictures
main warning: PTS is out of range (-28282), dropping buffer
main warning: buffer is 58784 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: PTS is out of range (-26524), dropping buffer
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (50256)
main warning: buffer is 73020 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: PTS is out of range (-35474), dropping buffer
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (50108)
main warning: buffer is 90003 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: PTS is out of range (-33957), dropping buffer
main warning: buffer is 59982 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: PTS is out of range (-21554), dropping buffer
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (50273)
main warning: buffer is 74234 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: PTS is out of range (-31464), dropping buffer
main warning: buffer is 41859 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (55572)
main warning: timing screwed, stopping resampling
main warning: buffer is 83139 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (44902)
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (50116)
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (50122)
main warning: resampling stopped after 20024633 usec (drift: -54571)
main warning: buffer is 54738 late, triggering upsampling
main debug: control type=1


2. Calling the .DAT file on the disk from within VLC:

main debug: adding playlist item `F:\MPEGAV\AVSEQ01.DAT' ( F:\MPEGAV\AVSEQ01.DAT )
main debug: creating new input thread
main debug: waiting for thread completion
main debug: thread 3736 (input) created at priority 1 (src/input/input.c:252)
main warning: drive letter F: found in source
main debug: `F:\MPEGAV\AVSEQ01.DAT' gives access `' demux `' path `F:\MPEGAV\AVSEQ01.DAT'
main debug: creating demux: access='' demux='' path='F:\MPEGAV\AVSEQ01.DAT'
main debug: looking for access_demux module: 1 candidate
skins2 warning: Cannot find node with id 5
main debug: creating access '' path='F:\MPEGAV\AVSEQ01.DAT'
main debug: looking for access2 module: 5 candidates
vcd debug: trying .cue file: F:\MPEGAV\AVSEQ01.cue
access_file debug: opening file `F:\MPEGAV\AVSEQ01.DAT'
main debug: using access2 module "access_file"
main debug: pre buffering
main debug: received first data for our buffer
main debug: prebuffering done 1408981 bytes in 0s - 14696 kbytes/s
main debug: creating demux: access='' demux='' path='F:\MPEGAV\AVSEQ01.DAT'
main debug: looking for demux2 module: 42 candidates
ps warning: this does not look like an MPEG PS stream, continuing anyway
main debug: using demux2 module "ps"
main debug: looking for a subtitle file in F:\MPEGAV\
main debug: `F:\MPEGAV\AVSEQ01.DAT' successfully opened
ps warning: garbage at input, trying to resync...
ps warning: found sync code
main debug: selecting program id=0
main debug: looking for decoder module: 26 candidates
main debug: using decoder module "libmpeg2"
main debug: thread 4692 (decoder) created at priority 0 (src/input/decoder.c:159)
main debug: looking for decoder module: 26 candidates
main debug: using decoder module "mpeg_audio"
main debug: thread 4668 (decoder) created at priority 2 (src/input/decoder.c:159)
libmpeg2 debug: 352x288 (display 352,288), aspect 563200, sar 16:15, 25.000 fps
main debug: no usable vout present, spawning one
main debug: window size: 781x331
main debug: looking for video output module: 5 candidates
main debug: Registering subpicture channel, ID: 2
main debug: Registering subpicture channel, ID: 3
main debug: Registering subpicture channel, ID: 4
main debug: Registering subpicture channel, ID: 5
mpeg_audio debug: MPGA channels:2 samplerate:48000 bitrate:112
main debug: looking for audio output module: 3 candidates
aout_directx debug: OpenAudio
aout_directx debug: found device: Primary Sound Driver
aout_directx debug: found device: Conexant AMC Audio
aout_directx debug: found device: Modem #0 Line Playback (emulated)
aout_directx debug: device supports 2 channels
aout_directx debug: device supports 1 channel
aout_directx debug: creating DirectSoundThread
main debug: thread 5044 (DirectSound Notification Thread) created at priority 15 (directx.c:374)
aout_directx debug: DirectSoundThread ready
main debug: using audio output module "aout_directx"
main debug: output 's16l' 48000 Hz Stereo frame=1 samples/4 bytes
main debug: mixer 'fl32' 48000 Hz Stereo frame=1 samples/8 bytes
main debug: filter(s) 'fl32'->'s16l' 48000 Hz->48000 Hz Stereo->Stereo
main debug: looking for audio filter module: 24 candidates
main debug: using audio filter module "float32tos16"
main debug: found a filter for the whole conversion
main debug: looking for audio mixer module: 3 candidates
main debug: using audio mixer module "trivial_mixer"
main debug: input 'mpga' 48000 Hz Stereo frame=1152 samples/1161 bytes
main debug: filter(s) 'mpga'->'fl32' 48000 Hz->48000 Hz Stereo->Stereo
main debug: looking for audio filter module: 24 candidates
main debug: using audio filter module "mpgatofixed32"
main debug: found a filter for the whole conversion
main debug: filter(s) 'fl32'->'fl32' 52800 Hz->48000 Hz Stereo->Stereo
main debug: looking for audio filter module: 24 candidates
main debug: using audio filter module "bandlimited_resampler"
main debug: found a filter for the whole conversion
vout_directx debug: creating DirectXEventThread
main debug: waiting for thread completion
vout_directx debug: DirectXCreateWindow
vout_directx debug: Created video sub-window
main debug: thread 5096 (DirectX Events Thread) created at priority 0 (directx.c:263)
vout_directx debug: DirectXEventThread running
vout_directx debug: DirectXInitDDraw
vout_directx debug: directx-device:
vout_directx debug: DirectXEnumCallback: Primary Display Driver, display
vout_directx debug: DirectXEnumCallback: RADEON IGP 345M, \\.\DISPLAY1
vout_directx debug: selecting RADEON IGP 345M, \\.\DISPLAY1
vout_directx debug: screen dimensions (0x0,1024x768)
vout_directx debug: DirectDraw Capabilities: overlay=1 yuvoverlay=1 can_deinterlace_overlay=1 colorkey=1 stretch=1 bltfourcc=1
vout_directx debug: End DirectXInitDDraw
vout_directx debug: DirectXCreateDisplay
vout_directx debug: DirectXCreateClipper
skins2 debug: control query not supported
vout_directx debug: disabling screen saver
main debug: using video output module "vout_directx"
vout_directx debug: NewPictureVec overlay:yes chroma:YV12
vout_directx debug: YUV overlay created successfully
vout_directx debug: End NewPictureVec (succeeded)
main debug: got 1 direct buffer(s)
main debug: picture in 352x288 (0,0,352x288), chroma I420, ar 176:135, sar 16:15
main debug: picture user 352x288 (0,0,352x288), chroma I420, ar 176:135, sar 16:15
main debug: picture out 352x288 (0,0,352x288), chroma I420, ar 176:135, sar 16:15
main debug: direct render, mapping render pictures 0-6 to system pictures 1-7
main debug: waiting for thread completion
main debug: thread 5124 (video output) created at priority 1 (src/video_output/video_output.c:420)
main warning: dts != current_pts (-240819)
main warning: vout synchro warning: pts != current_date (-40000)
main warning: late picture skipped (-6607)
main warning: late picture skipped (132805)
main warning: late picture skipped (93201)
main warning: late picture skipped (53531)
main warning: late picture skipped (13859)
main warning: late picture skipped (50806)
main warning: late picture skipped (35505)
main debug: decoded 115/120 pictures
main debug: control type=1


3. Clicking on the .BIN file to open VLC:

main warning: PTS is out of range (-38746), dropping buffer
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (44900)
main warning: buffer is 71973 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: PTS is out of range (-26712), dropping buffer
main warning: buffer is 47785 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (50120)
main warning: timing screwed, stopping resampling
main warning: buffer is 86780 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: PTS is out of range (-19875), dropping buffer
main warning: buffer is 62613 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: PTS is out of range (-28623), dropping buffer
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (50145)
main warning: buffer is 76738 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: PTS is out of range (-35107), dropping buffer
main warning: buffer is 44363 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (50227)
main warning: PTS is out of range (-20521), dropping buffer
main warning: buffer is 58402 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: PTS is out of range (-24414), dropping buffer
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (50147)
main warning: buffer is 72528 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (50228)
main warning: resampling stopped after 12860634 usec (drift: -49715)
main warning: buffer is 49881 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (50300)
main warning: timing screwed, stopping resampling
main warning: buffer is 92598 late, triggering upsampling
main warning: output date isn't PTS date, requesting resampling (50290)
main debug: control type=1

I should also mention that changing DirectX float32 option or changing the resampling option has no effect on this problem. Also I am experiencing no problems with other modules or formats within VLC.

[DJ]

In recent days I have discovered that playing MPEG1 files in VLC has no error resiliency. When it comes across an error the screen may go blank or after the error you may discover multiple audio and video tracks that aren't there.

All Direct Show players use Microsoft's MPEG1 filters and there is no problem playing these files.

As I have mentioned earlier in this blog, the problem started with VLC 0.8.4 and continues in the nightly builds.

There isn't even an error report in the to do list as non of the developers will recognize the problem.

VLC is a dud when it comes to playing VCDs or MPEG1 files and you are asking for trouble by trying.

The other option is a perfect mpeg file, but I have never seen one of those.

In trying to resolve this using various nightly builds I have also discovered that VLC is defeating the power down functions of my machine and not restoring them when I exit the program. This is true only after playing a video and closing the program. As long as I don't use VLC the power functions are normal.

This is getting very frustrating guys! While I like VLC for the things it can do, I am also beginning to hate it for the things it supposed to do and doesn't.

[DJ]

I spent a bit of time today with VCDs again. I took the worst file (VCD) I own and tried playing it with different players using different codecs or libraries.

Here are the results:

Using Media Player Classic, Windows Media Player 10 or Graph Edit. All of these players call the stock Microsoft codecs or Direct Show (ActiveX) filters (MPEG splitter, MPEG audio decoder and MPEG video decoder). The file plays through in its entirety with no sound problems. Occasionally there is a very slight blocky effect in the video and happens in two places through the file. This problem (probable error in the file) is consistent within time or place in the file.

However, when I call the disk with MPC, it plays as though I had called the dat file directly, (IE no navigation) and there is no apparent difference in how it plays. This does appear to be normal for this player as I have never seen navigation using this player with VCDs.

Using WinDVD to play the Disk. This player uses its own filters to play the VCD as a VCD2 disk with features. The VCD plays with no audio or video problems not even showing the two places with a slight blockyness and the disk plays in its entirety.

Using VLC, There is no combination of methods that allow this Disk or file to play. When playing as a VCD disk the audio is constantly doing re sync. When playing as a file it is blocky in the same places as the windows players were, but the sound is not trying to re sync as when trying to play it as a VCD. Vlc stops playing the file 5.5 min into the file with an eof. Neither of the other two methods showed even a hint of problem near this time frame.

While few want to acknowledge this as a problem, it exists with all MPEG1 files and there is still no trouble report (ticket) on it. The problem is very real and the problem is within VLC.

I can play other types of files in every other type of container that VLC supports and I do not experience problems like this, once again proving that the problem is within VLC for this file type. I can find no VCDs (even commercial VCDs) that play properly within VLC. However, some (pristine) dat files will play. Again this problem started with 0.8.4 and continues to present in the nightly builds.

Hope this is helpful to someone!

[The DJ]

Well the problem is mostly that all the VCD standards kinda took the MPEG1 and MPEG2 video codec standards and then, well.... ignored them basically.

EOF in a file == EOF. A player should stop playing the file. For VLC it is important to honor this. (streaming based remember. it can't check the filesize, so that would be an issue if you wanna stop the stream.

the problem basicaly is that VLC treats VCDs mostly as MPEG, but it's not. it's VCD-MPEG.

why no one is interested in this:
1: no one uses VCDs (at least not in the VLC team)
2: fixing it probably requires heavy hacking in the mpeg codec modules to work around VCD issues. lot of work and kinda a waste of time.
3: there are two VCD modules in VLC. the vcd module and the vcdx module

a: vcd module basically plays the .dat file and doesn't think about anything twice. It was never really finished and never worked 100%
b: vcdx module supports the navigation module. However it is currently without maintainer and still contains some SERIOUS issues.

And unfortunatly, without someone joining the team who plays 20 VCDs a week this situation isn't gonna change.

[DJ]

Well the problem is mostly that all the VCD standards kinda took the MPEG1 and MPEG2 video codec standards and then, well.... ignored them basically.

EOF in a file == EOF. A player should stop playing the file. For VLC it is important to honor this. (streaming based remember. it can't check the filesize, so that would be an issue if you wanna stop the stream.

the problem basicaly is that VLC treats VCDs mostly as MPEG, but it's not. it's VCD-MPEG.

why no one is interested in this:
1: no one uses VCDs (at least not in the VLC team)
2: fixing it probably requires heavy hacking in the mpeg codec modules to work around VCD issues. lot of work and kinda a waste of time.
3: there are two VCD modules in VLC. the vcd module and the vcdx module

a: vcd module basically plays the .dat file and doesn't think about anything twice. It was never really finished and never worked 100%
b: vcdx module supports the navigation module. However it is currently without maintainer and still contains some SERIOUS issues.

And unfortunatly, without someone joining the team who plays 20 VCDs a week this situation isn't gonna change.

\

OK! I get it! I wrote a response to an inquire last night that was similar.

How about this: I will stop complaining if you agree to write a trouble report on it so at least it won't be lost for someone else to fine it.

OR

Remove it from the supported file types if you really believe it is dead and will never be revived.

I still find it amazing how well this worked in 0.8.2 and how bad it works in 0.8.4 it's like someone really wants it to fail!

[DJ]

Well I guess it's time to move this up the list again, considering it doesn't seem important enough to make it to the To Do List.

I find it strange that it is considered so UN important even dead.

I have been noticing that other users don't feel this way!

So I will continue my complaining about this problem until such time it has a ticket for repair.

[Guest]

Well the problem is mostly that all the VCD standards kinda took the MPEG1 and MPEG2 video codec standards and then, well.... ignored them basically.

I'm not sure this is correct. I've looked at the VCD specification from Philips and it just says MPEG streams are used. It does not suggest or require any deviation.

...
the problem basicaly is that VLC treats VCDs mostly as MPEG, but it's not. it's VCD-MPEG.

This a little slanted. It is possible and even probable that various manufacturers produce MPEGs for VCDs in a way that vlc can't currently handle. However almost every other media players do handle MPEGs for most VCDs/SVCDs. For example xine and mplayer do. Furthermore in both of these cases there is no special MPEG handler other than the basic handler that is used for any other MPEG.

As noted elsewhere in these forums, vlc used to be able to play these VCDs. So the brokenness is not in the VCD/SVCD standard - that didn't change. Nor the vlc's VCD plugin; that didn't change either. If things are broken, they got broken presumably by a change to the way that vlc now requres MPEGs to be handled.

b: vcdx module supports the navigation module. However it is currently without maintainer and still contains some SERIOUS issues.

If you are looking for a mantainer perhaps then these issues should be documented.

And unfortunatly, without someone joining the team who plays 20 VCDs a week

I know for a fact that the last "maintainer" in fact did not play 20 VCDs a week. But this kind of "shoot-from-the-hip" remark is consistent with the other remarks above of a similar quality.

this situation isn't gonna change.

So for folks who want a media player that can handle VCD's SVCD's there is either mplayer or xine. xine at present is the most advanced when it comes to handling menus, mouse hot spots, and playback control (navigation).

[DJ]

Well the problem is mostly that all the VCD standards kinda took the MPEG1 and MPEG2 video codec standards and then, well.... ignored them basically.

I'm not sure this is correct. I've looked at the VCD specification from Philips and it just says MPEG streams are used. It does not suggest or require any deviation.

...
the problem basicaly is that VLC treats VCDs mostly as MPEG, but it's not. it's VCD-MPEG.

This a little slanted. It is possible and even probable that various manufacturers produce MPEGs for VCDs in a way that vlc can't currently handle. However almost every other media players do handle MPEGs for most VCDs/SVCDs. For example xine and mplayer do. Furthermore in both of these cases there is no special MPEG handler other than the basic handler that is used for any other MPEG.

As noted elsewhere in these forums, vlc used to be able to play these VCDs. So the brokenness is not in the VCD/SVCD standard - that didn't change. Nor the vlc's VCD plugin; that didn't change either. If things are broken, they got broken presumably by a change to the way that vlc now requres MPEGs to be handled.

b: vcdx module supports the navigation module. However it is currently without maintainer and still contains some SERIOUS issues.

If you are looking for a mantainer perhaps then these issues should be documented.

And unfortunatly, without someone joining the team who plays 20 VCDs a week

I know for a fact that the last "maintainer" in fact did not play 20 VCDs a week. But this kind of "shoot-from-the-hip" remark is consistent with the other remarks above of a similar quality.

this situation isn't gonna change.

So for folks who want a media player that can handle VCD's SVCD's there is either mplayer or xine. xine at present is the most advanced when it comes to handling menus, mouse hot spots, and playback control (navigation).

Thanks for the incite! I have worked with Philips Corp. and already know some of the answers. Played a minor part with the committees that formed the MPEG-1 and 2 specification. Haven't kept up in a while though as I just read the MPEG-TS spec a few nights ago. I have also done consulting work for many major Manufactures and know when I am being snowed.

Some of these conclusions, I have begun to suspect on my own.

There have been quit a few real bugs show up in the last few weeks some of which are acknowledged and others that are completely ignored. When I say real it means that I have been able to duplicate the problem. It seems that the main things that are worked on at the moment are features. I only wish that it was also consistency! This says nothing about some of the real bugs.

I have been poking around and have noticed a huge lack of organization in certain areas. There are other things I have noticed, that would very definitely turn me off as a programmer who has joined the team to add to or maintain sections of VLC. I have a feeling that the existing VLC team is having a difficult time keeping people on board and there is not enough time and or money to do it all themselves, assuming that was possible.

I life attitude is everything! So just keep

[Guest]

Furthermore in both of these cases there is no special MPEG handler other than the basic handler that is used for any other MPEG.

In the interest of being pedantically accurate, I'd like to make a slight correction or clarification. xine does have two classes of MPEG handlers. One is for streams which I guess would be useful in streaming. The other is for fixed-blocksize devices such as DVD and VCD. However the point remains that there is nothing VCD- or SVCD- specific in the "block" MPEG demuxer.

[DJ]

Furthermore in both of these cases there is no special MPEG handler other than the basic handler that is used for any other MPEG.

In the interest of being pedantically accurate, I'd like to make a slight correction or clarification. xine does have two classes of MPEG handlers. One is for streams which I guess would be useful in streaming. The other is for fixed-blocksize devices such as DVD and VCD. However the point remains that there is nothing VCD- or SVCD- specific in the "block" MPEG demuxer.

I tried superficially to see what was going on in VLC by dumping older modules that worked back into the newer program with minor modifications. It was rather difficult at first seeing the groups that worked togeather but once I got it nothing had changed. Therefore proving that the maintainer of these modules is not the problem. Starting with 1/16/06 0.8.5 this is no longer possible. But there is something in the main program that is not allowing these modules to function properly.

Perhaps you are right and it is time to look for something else. At the moment WMP (sigh!) has been working OK! as has Gabest's MPC using the stock Microsoft codecs.

[DJ]

I had a request last night to watch a Movie and I cringed when I heard it was the one I used for the examples here. The worst one I own. You know, the one VLC will not play under any circumstances.

So I decided to make disks so it could be played on the family DVD player.

Much to my delight it played with out one hiccup and I throughly enjoyed the movie. No sound problems. No Video problems. The sound was always in sync with the picture.

This makes three other players that can play this VCD perfectly and still there is no problem ticket on this obvious BUG.

I know MPEG-1 isn't dead. So I'm wondering when the developers are going to wake up and realize this.

[DJ]

If you try encoding or transcoding a file into MPEG-1 using mp1v and mpga using VLC the end result is the same as this one:

viewtopic.php?t=15779

However, it does kinda sorta play. No problems with other players.

[GuEst999]

Similiar problem here. Version 8.4 and 8.4.a - audio skipping when playing VCDs. Version 8.1 plays fine. I always hang on to an older working version in case of problems like this.

[GuEst999]

I find that instead of playing the disc as a vcd, instead, I play it as a file and navigate to the AVSEQ01.MPG file, then the disc plays just fine. Workaround for me.

[DJ]

Ya! This works with most VCDs, unfortunatly not all. Just like bin files will work too if you remove the cue file from the directory. Using the player this way means vcd2 disks have no features, plus the fact it anoying to have to remember it and the fact that it doesn't always work.

[GuEst999]

It works, but on the two I tried, crop wasn't working - the main reason I was playing the VCDs through VLC.