How to disable planar YUV media types?

[BuffBoy]

Hello,

Just recently my friend and I got our hands
On two old HP use to be high-end workstations.
HP Visualize & HP x4000.

One came with HP FX10 Pro graphic card,
second was ATI FireGL 4 card.

According to docs cards are suppose to support
Direct7 & OpenGL 1.1.

Now, as a minimum we wanted to play DVD
On the hardware we have got.

PowerDVD 6 did play the DVD but it did show
A strange colors during playback, WinDVD have had
the same problem.

After long time I found the way to play a DVD on both machines.
The magic combination is to use Media Player Classic (MPC)
With disabled “Enable planar YUV media types (VY12, I420, IYUY)”
Option. It is under “Options | Mpeg Decoder” menu item.

After short time I installed VLC hoping to get the same DirectShow
Playback but using less CPU cycles.

Unfortunately I still can not figure out what combination of
Switches will get the result I want. Anything I try under
DirectShow | DirectX options is not helping me.

So here goes my question:

What would be the direct translation of the disabled MPC
“Enable planar YUV media types (VY12, I420, IYUY)”
Option in VLC?

BTW: VLC OpenGL playback works for me, but the CPU
Consumption is quite high (60-70%). Plus the play back is
kind of choppy. My workstation is dual PIII 1GHz with 2GB of memory
running Windows 2003 server.

Thank you in advance.

BuffBoy

[BuffBoy]

Update: tried all variations "Video input chroma format option"
(Preferences | Input / Codecs | Access modules | DirectShow)
Still the same result (colors are off). As a matter of fact I was not
sure if this option is working at all, b/s the output did not change a bit.

I do not know how can I post a screenshot here, may be it would give somebody an idea.

BuffBoy

[Guest]

Most of the newer versions of Players (WinDVD, PowerDVD etc.) will require that you update DirectX to 9c. Once you do this you may also find it necessary to update your Video card's drivers. Given the age of the cards, drivers may no longer be an option. As I remember the fire gl was supposed to be a monster gaming card in OpenGL hey day. But many of the cards of this period did not support Overlay functions or thought about support for Multi-Media Video or the DVD. DirectX solutions were rudimentary.

The greater majority of programs playing Video today use the YUY2 format.

I have noticed that Nero 7 seems to be the exception. The easy answer here is replace the video card. While in practice the card buss type may be a consideration. Ebay anyone?

[BuffBoy]

Hello Guest,

Thank you for a reply.

I see your point, but I do not want to sell my card on eBay just because of bad DirectShow DVD playback in VLC player.

If you check my original post, Media Player Classic (MPC) IS ABLE to play a DVD using DirectShow output (it only supports DirectShow as far as I know).
Yes, I had to tweak the MPC to work with my old card, but it DOES work.

So my logic here is this: if MPC can be tweaked to play DVD then VLC would be too. If only I know what the options are.

Anyway, I made a post here just because I want VLC do be as good DirectShow player as MPC is. At this point it is not. Well maybe it is, but I do not know how to tweak it.

I know if I disable “Enable planar YUV media types (VY12, I420, IYUY)” in
MPC I get good DirectShow playback. Why VLC does not have this option?
Or similar option?

I think the best person to answer my question would be somebody who implemented DirectShow in VLC or at least somebody who is familiar with the source code.

If anybody wants to implement this option in VLC I am offering my hardware and time to test it.

[DJ]

VLC is not a Direct Show Player it uses its own libraries to play media files.

I version 0.8.4 the DirectX module was rebuilt to make VLC more compatible with DirectX 9c this has forced many people to update their Video Card's drivers and for some the sound card's drivers.

This function is a normal occurrence after installing SP2 for Windows XP and should be accomplished not only for VLC as the changes allow for better communications between DirectX and your video card in preparation for HD Video.

In your case you could try:

1. shutting down DirectX for Video within VLC instead select the Windows GDI video output.

2. changing the DirectX hardware handling of YUV->RGB conversions within VLC.

3. shutting off the Overlay function within VLC, which will shutdown video acceleration.

4. an earlier version of VLC, like 0.8.2

All of these things (except 4) will put more weight on your CPU as does the change you made in MPC. If you are happy with this you are welcome to try any of these suggestions.

[BuffBoy]

Hello DJ, thank you for a reply.

VLC is not a Direct Show Player it uses its own libraries to play media files.

Ok. So, VLC calls DirectX API directly, and does not use DirectShow layer. Right?

Last night I tried options you suggested.

1. shutting down DirectX for Video within VLC instead select the Windows GDI video output.

Switching to GDI I get DVD playback CPU utilization around 50%. This is interesting, because OpenGL option uses around 65%. My graphic card (HP FX10 Pro) driver has “optimize GDI output” option, may be this is the reason why the CPU percentage is relatively low. And yes colors are correct.

2. changing the DirectX hardware handling of YUV->RGB conversions within VLC.

Well, according to the help hint this option is only available in the overlay mode. If I switch OFF the overlay mode I get extremely slow playback. So, this option is not an option In overlay mode it did not make any difference as expected.

3. shutting off the Overlay function within VLC, which will shutdown video acceleration.

This option makes an extremely slow playback. I can literally see frames switching,
Like a slide show. Colors are correct thought.

4. an earlier version of VLC, like 0.8.2

Installed 8.0.2, cleared all the old config files, did not notice any difference in DirectX output.

All of these things (except 4) will put more weight on your CPU as does the change you made in MPC

Actually the disabled “Enable planar YUV media types (VY12, I420, IYUY)” option in MPC adds only 1-2% into CPU utilization if anything at all. I would say 2% is a good trade-off for a correct DirectX DVD playback.

Below is a summary table for a DVD playback CPU utilization for HP FX10 Pro card:

Using MPC:

- default options, wrong colors – 34%
- disabled “Enable planar YUV media types (VY12, I420, IYUY)”, right colors - 36%

Using VLC (from high to low):

- default options, OpenGL, right colors – 65%
- default options, GDI, right colors – 50%
- default options, DirectX, wrong colors – 28%
- disabled “use triple buffering for overlays”, DirectX, wrong colors – 5%

Here are my conclusions so far:

- DirectX always produces the best result under Windows.
- VLC is capable of a DVD playback via DirectX with an amazingly low CPU utilization (5% )
- VLC can be adjusted to work with older Direct7 hardware (as MPC)
- I do not know how to adjust VLC for Direct7 graphic card or to put it differently how to disable “planar YUV media types”

[DJ]

Gabest's MPC is rather an unusual player and some of the options he offers are equally unusual. I am a bit surprised that the CPU usage varied only 2% as I would have expected more.

Most programs don't allow for backward movement in DirectX. Microsoft claims it isn't necessary, because when you upgrade DirectX it provides backward compatibility. For the majority of cards and usage this is true. However, there are always a few that need their drivers updated.

Some of the switches you changed were dependent on DirectX, so you may not have actually gotten accurate results like the Overlay function that shuts down Video Acceleration.

But if you think you are going to get all of the functions with DirectX 9c when you are still using DirectX 7 dream on. Installing DirectX 9c is supposed to allow programs (and video cards) backward compatibility. But I would have no idea as to what a new program will do with an old DirectX version. Crash maybe! Lucky when it doesn't! Work correctly? Doubtful!

So perhaps you should stick with MPC and start learning Windows Direct Show system. I have! I support every format and container that VLC offers using MPC and without any conflicts.

Nice to hear you did get VLC working though.
By the way my reference to Ebay earlier was for finding a compatible newer card not for selling one, though that may not be a bad idea considering your CPU(s) seems to be fast enough.

[BuffBoy]

Thank you for a reply DJ,

I think I finally found a clue on how to make VLC working the same way MPC does. Yesterday I spent few hours trying all the possible combinations of filters and options.

Guess what? I found it! In order to view a DVD I need to lay on a couch or rotate a monitor 90 degree.

Now seriously, if I apply a transformation filter with 90 or 270 degree DirectX playback colors are suddenly good again! I hope you would not ask me why, but colors are as good as in MPC.

For some reason 90 and 270 rotations are the only transformations working. Any other transformations still render wrong colors. And any other filter did not help. I can try to play with MPEG2 decoder options if you want me to, but I do not know where they are.

So, DJ, would it be possible to take 90 degree transformation code and trim it to the point of having good colors and do not actually rotate a picture? All the poor folks who is still running Direct7 cards would really appreciate this kind of filter.

What do you think?

[DJ]

This is still a problem between DirextX and your Video Card. When you shut down DirectX it works. More often tha not assuming the DirectX version is current (we know it's not) the problem is Video card drivers. I'm not sure why you are intent on being the last hold out in the world with DirectX 7 ??? If you search the web I sure you would come up with drivers for your video card.

Have you ever tried to reset your Video Card for Direct3d, OpenGL, Colors and Overlay?

Might be a good thing to reset VLC too.

[BuffBoy]

This is still a problem between DirextX and your Video Card.

I agree.

When you shut down DirectX it works.

Correct

If you search the web I sure you would come up with drivers for your video card.

The latest drivers I found dated 2002. The HP does not support this card on Windows anymore.

Have you ever tried to reset your Video Card for Direct3d, OpenGL, Colors and Overlay?

No, there is no reset button in the Driver UI anywhere. Is there a generic way to reset video cards?

Might be a good thing to reset VLC too.

Delete "C:\Documents and Settings\<user>\Application Data\vlc"?

I'm not sure why you are intent on being the last hold out in the world with DirectX 7

Very simple reason. This card is good enough for me. It does what I want and I am not going to replace it just yet. When I want latest DirectX support I run my other computer with NVidia 6800GT.

I am here not because I am desperate and not because VLC is the only choice.

The only reason I am posting here is because I was hoping to help you guys to make a better software, VLC in this case. If you have no desire/plan/intention supporting old hardware it is fine with me. Just say it then and I will not post here anymore. Deal?

[DJ]

If there is no utilities provided for the video card there is a good possibility that no settings are saved. Unfortunately this is not always true. ATI cards for example have always had utilities available and when you didn't install them, other programs still could change and set features of the card without you being able to reset it. I'm not aware of a generic way to reset a video card. In fact it is possible that reinstalling the drivers may not reset the card. I haven't seen a video card in the last 10 or more years that didn't have utilities where you couldn't reset the card.

Every two or three years Microsoft does something that makes you get new drivers for your card, These days they generally provide updates on their website. But for some of the more obscure cards I have found websites that are offering updated drivers long after the manufacture has stopped supporting the chipset. In your case it should be something dated after Oct. or Nov. 04 assuming XP SP2.

Most of us buy new video cards when the old one dies, can't find support for it any more or want some new late great feature the old one doesn't have. If you like your old card, fine. If it's good enough to do everything you want, great. But you can't expect a program vendor to provide support specifically for your device. This methodology stopped with DOS.

I'm not asking you to stop posting here. This is an open Forum to everyone that wants to use VLC. But VLC by your own admission is usable on your machine, it just takes to much CPU usage for you. As this is not a problem with VLC but instead a problem with your hardware it ends up being your decision.

Personally if I really wanted to keep the video card I think I would at least try to update DirectX and try a little harder to find updated drivers and utilities. But that's me! Another option woud be to try an older version of VLC, somthing earlier than 0.8.4

Regarding Reseting VLC:
Delete "C:\Documents and Settings\<user>\Application Data\vlc"? Yes!

[BuffBoy]

DJ, I really do appreciate the time you spent answering my questions. Writing and supporting freeware is tough, I know that first hand. Unfortunately you did not convince me (and you do not have to) it is really a hardware problem. MPC is a living proof it can be done. I will stick with the MPC as a player of choice under Windows. Thank you again.

[DJ]

DJ, I really do appreciate the time you spent answering my questions. Writing and supporting freeware is tough, I know that first hand. Unfortunately you did not convince me (and you do not have to) it is really a hardware problem. MPC is a living proof it can be done. I will stick with the MPC as a player of choice under Windows. Thank you again.

The only reason I support VLC is because I believe in it. It is the only program that I have seen that not only supports almost everything you can throw at it but is also allows transcoding of files, streaming support for some 4 or 5 standards and also supports 9 different subtitle formats both internal and external. I have never seen another program like it and it's free. While MPC is a good player it will take you time to find and install the right combination of Direct Show codecs to begin to match or exceed VLC's quality. Took me months of searching and trial and error before I got it to where I am happy with MPC.

But, I am delighted you finally made a decision!